Friday, 9 March 2007

Can We CoExist?

Last week I met a Scottish friend of mine while I was out walking, he introduced me to another Scottish man that was with him and told me that he was a new comer to London, I chatted for few minutes then left. Few days ago I saw my Scottish friend again, he told me what had happened after I left him and his friend that day, his friend asked him if I was a Muslim to which he replied yes, the other guy then said that he was surprised because he thought I was nice (i.e. not a nasty Muslim terrorist), my friend asked him why he said that to which the other guy replied that he does not trust Muslims, my friend asked him how many Muslims he knows, the reply was non, he never even met a Muslim before, he comes from an isolated community in Scotland and it was his first time in London, my friend then told him that he should be more open minded and that there are good & bad in every race & religion. Obviously I was not very happy when I heard that and thought the guy was an ignorant person and I told my friend that coming from an isolated community does not give this guy an excuse to think that all Muslims are bad, I mean this man is in his 30s or 40s surely he knows that the media can twist everything and did he forget when not so long ago here in Britain Christian factions used to kill one another over the Northern Ireland issue? cant he see what the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians & Lebanese, did he not hear of the atrocities committed in Rwanda by people that are not Muslims and is he so ignorant that he can not see what is happening in Iraq!
We all know that a minority of stupid so called Muslims have committed awful crimes in the west but any educated decent person would know that they do not represent all Muslims, that would be like if I said that I do not trust Christians because of what they did in Bosnia for example, of course this is nonsense as these crimes were committed by people that have nothing to do with Christianity. Unfortunately it seems many people in Europe have forgotten about many atrocities committed until recently yet they seem to think that all Muslims are criminals and should not be trusted.

The New Wembley Stadium
At last the new Wembley Stadium is ready, its keys are to be handed to the owners today, it took six and a half years to complete which is about 2 years over due at a cost of about £800 million which is double its original budget.
It can seat 90,000 people which makes it one of the biggest in the world, it has 2681 public toilets which is more than any other building in the world,the FA Cup Final will be held at Wembley Stadium on 19 May and the first ever pop concert will be held there on June 9 &10 by George Michael.


Lebeeya said...

Ignorant people say ignorant things :)

There’s a little thing called common sense that helps (most) people realize that the 'terrorist' Muslims are not representative of the entirety of Islam.

There are definitely people of all types everywhere. "Terrorists" are everywhere, the leaders of UK and US are also terrorists...but different types.......

I believe as u mentioned, the media does twist everything and takes things out of context and encourages confusion and misunderstanding (at least then they've something to report as well as satisfying their agenda of fueling hatred between Muslims and the west).

Good Muslims don't become terrorists.. Confused, ignorant and deranged ones are those who resort to terror and violence. Good Muslims have more peaceful and intelligent ways of dealing with issues.

AngloLibyan said...

that was really well put lebeeya, thank you.

white african said...

its frustrating especially when you see examples of non-muslims commiting acts of terrorism, their race, religion etc does not come into question then, take the postal man who sent letter bombs, why are the media so quite about him, reason is he is not a muslim.

th best we can do is be a true example of what a muslim really is.

you did your on dawah there anglo, hopefully you have manage dto change his opinions :)

Brave Heart said...

i think it's our duty AL,we must do our best to show the true face of islam,even the muslium who called Terrorists i consider their actions as a reaction, i met many people they dont know about islam anything ,just they knew qaida due the media and i dont blame them cos we dont do our efforts to change this radical picture.
i used to live near the stadium for 3 months when i came from libya.

Lebeeya said...

I agree with what White African and Braveheart said. We as muslims need to spread and show a true example of Islam as it should have been spread! Unfortunitly, many muslims are doing quite the opposite, instead of presenting the right teachings they are by day creating more and more hatred for it.

I don't blame them for wanting to fight the west - because the west's prints are all over the middle east, but I do blame them for beheading innocents, killing their own children and civilians and other atrocities they carry in the name of Islam..

Suliman said...

Greetings, all! Just a couple of questions from left field, guys and gals.

1. Consider this: Usama bin Laden runs for president in an open and fair, equal opportunity election in a country like Egypt, Pakistan or Saudi Arabia. In your honest opinion, do you think he will win or lose?

My answer: He will wib by a landslide.

2. In the aftermath of 9/11, there were wide-scale public demonstrations celebrating the attacks. Do you think those people who filled the streets represent mainstream or fringe Muslims?

My answer: They represent the mainstream.

3. What do you think of the recent Libyan law to ban women under 40 from traveling without a chaperon? Is that an example of "good Muslim" or "bad Muslim" law?

My answer: It is a law that can only get support in uncivilized societies.

Anonymous said...

Thanks Anglo,

In my opinion, we as Muslims living in the west have an image problem

AngloLibyan said...

whiteafrican, thank God that the post man is not Muslim. I do agree that we have to do our best to improve the image.

braveheart unfortunately you are right that many here know nothing about Islam, the mainstream decent Muslims have a duty to stand up and show the real Islam.
I live near the stadium and it really is a magnificent sight.

thank you again lebeeya.

Suliman, its always good to have you commenting here :o)
I lived most of my life in Europe and can not say what people in arabic or islamic countries would do if Bin Laden runs for presidency, I would like to think that most Muslims are decent and will not vote for a criminal like him.
I have seen some demonstrations about 9/11 but they were small gathering in Palestine, these people are opressed, it was wrong but the USA & Israel made them full of hate.
I have commented against the stupid Libyan law on few blogs, the Libyan government is not an Islamic government as we all know, this law is degrading and will never work.

Thanks cofman and yes we do have an image problem.

mani said...


Again, great post Anglo. I just wish to comment a little on the distinction Leebya used for the first post between Good Muslims, and Bad Muslims. Its really important to understand that the biggest point that attackers of 'Islam' rest on is the teaching of 'Islam' itself. the fact that terms like good/bad mulsims only strengthen their discourse that in Islam yes there is a capacity or 'badness'. many people say that 'terrorist islamists' are those that are following islam and the Quran to the letter and that 'moderate' or 'good' Muslims are those that espouse secularist values and ideals of modernity and human reason... basically, 'good' muslims are only 'good' when educated and brought up to a western values and standards... this is shared by MANY MUSLIMS too who are responsible for starting up movements labelled 'progressive Islam', 'Americanised Islam', Modern Islam' and 'Secular Islam' to name but a few. The danger is very real here as these 'islamic' movements reject interpretations of the Quran and confidently say that the Quran has to be understood in context (which i completley agree, scientific method) and as a product of its time (which I completley disagree with cause this argument nullifies the divinity of the message). The real problem we now face is when an attacker of islam flouts ayat from the Quran and ahadith that are directly derogatory to the prophet SAW and the deen of all time, BUT ARE IN FACT ATTRIBUTED to him y scholars whom we have ben brought up to almost worship. These attackers belong to the educated, intellectual political class which staffs the civil society departments and elite positions of influence in the western world.. their words in journalism, media, tv become gospel, model and path for those that drink this media.. but we have to remember.. that while they (academics and researchers and orientalists) are searching (or say they are) for the causes, we 'Muslims' ignore them directly and like to just defend our own moral goodness and our own intentions and just discard others as 'bad muslims. We have a duty to understand our Quran first and foremost as it seems to me despite those that recite and recite volumes a year..little is required of us to understand it seems because there are scholars that have done that.. so we have fallen into the trap and like Allah swt said etta7'athna hatha al kitab mahjoora.... point of reflection..

Here's a critique of the 'progressive Islam movement' in America, which has subsided relatively.. definitely the calm before the storm..

and this would be another topic if we went on but I wish to share a simple sentiment. International relations and autonomy of states is a farce. 911 was a coordinated conspiracy by bankers, military men and worlds elite to subordinate and scare the American people and thus the strongest state in the world into fear and submission so that it can carry out its grand imperial strategy. That's not conspiracy. that's fact. and if you want references ill be happy to supply libraries..

sorry for the rant :)

Anonymous said...

Mani, so true and unfortunately many of the Muslims bloggers ( some Libyan ) are falling for this trap thinking that they are serving Islam, or modernizing it and reforming it as they say. When they never really lived or practiced it in the first place to criticize it. They think just because they learnt a second Language and lived abroad for most of their lives they know better and they can understand the true meaning of Islam, when western culture can have an opposite effect of weakening the faith of those who were taught religion as a law without its practical significance. Of course they only hurt themselves and expose those who are already weak in faith with them.

Anonymous said...

Anglo, if you have 9 minutes to spare then ( watch this video )

AngloLibyan said...

mani & anonymous, thank you for your comments.

cofman, this documentary is called Women only Jihad, it was shown last year on channel 4, whiteafrican is involved in a simillar dispute, check her archive, i truely could not believe it when i found out that some mosques ban women and not only that but in a free country like the UK, I wish these ladies the best inshaAllah.

white african said...

i just want to comment on the 'muslims who where filmed celebrating the 911 attacks'

this was aired on cnn shortly after the attack and it was then later found that the clip they showed was something like 3 years old and it was of a wedding or engagmnet celebration in Palestine and had nothing to do with 911.

it just goes to show that media can easily manipulate and distort information for their own benefits.


Anonymous said...

thanks for the info, I didn’t know .. I’ll go and check whiteafrican’s page asap – what I was hoping the video would show was; our image of being decent muslims has been highjacked - not by Israel or the KGB – but highjacked by our own ‘representatives’.
But I am very optimistic ya Anglo, Very
Take for example the headline of an article that got published today “A Muslim association in Australia has banned five clerics from talking to the media”
Hopefully soon, ya Anglo, no more lunatics will be talking to world media on my behalf

Chatalaine / شاتالاين said...

People are afraid of the unknown. We all are. Our job is to help people understand that there are good and bad in each faith. The more lives you touch each day the more people will learn. We tend to want to be with people that share our own beliefs. That is only natural but we all must make an extra effort to meet people and share our own faith with them. It is not necessary for anyone to change their own faith just learn and understand others is enough.

piccolina said...

ooh yeah norman foster again .. wel done man
i met him when he came to libya , he is so great !

Anonymous said...

cofman here - I am going back to the question of image again, hope you don’t mind – I am still trying to understand what lies underneath your Scottish friend’s friend when he was a bit confused that you were nice AND Muslim – a surprising contradiction in his view
though too naïve and childish, his view isn’t really strange or unheard of – but obviously it is a lot worse when the authorities and police share his view and act accordingly with shocking consequences

I am sure you remember, anglo, the Brazilian guy that got shot and killed in London tube station some years ago,
He wasn’t muslim, was he?
The security agents were following him for weeks and weeks, and for some reason when they felt they couldn’t wait any longer they killed him:- 7 or 8 bullets entered his body – mainly because of his looks

Now when you think about it, if the security people with all the resources they have – and still get it so badly wrong - can you not imagine what the general public feel and fear ?

the reading I do suggest another attack, a big attack with either a dirty bomb, gas, or nuclear, on some western place, with many causalities, is coming.
They say they are confident that it isn’t a question of ‘if’ they will be attacked, but rather ‘when’
When that happens, god forbid, I fear governments will then be forced to act, and act swiftly
It will be their priority to make the public feel safe, and win their trust and confidence - it might introduce something like, I don’t know, maybe electronic tagging of some people, I am sure image will be one of the factors on which they will decide who to tag – remember, the government needs the vote of your friend’s friend, there are many people like your friend, and many feel even worse, if he doesn’t feel safe after the new big attack, he will go running with his vote to another political party, and give his vote to some National racist group/party
As you know, in a number of countries it has already started

Anonymous said...

Actually, for my own safety when that happens I may go to the police myself, and ask them to tag me so everybody who sees the tag will know that I am not a terrorist

AngloLibyan said...

thanks whiteafrican for this addition.

cofman you are welcome and thanks for your contribution to this topic. the Brazilian man was called Jean Charles de Menezes his killing was a mistake that is still haunting the British police although sometimes its difficult for the police as well, they were convinced that he was a suicide bomber and had no choice, unfortunately they had the wrong intelligence and the poor Brazilian had to pay for it.

thank you Chatalaine for your nice comment and I am glad to see you back.

Piccolina, I am so ashamed of myself, I did not know or forgotten that Norman Foster designed the new Wembley Stadium, thank you for the reminder, of course he designed the Gherkin here in London as well, what was he doing in Libya? I hope designing something really good and classy.

thanks anonymous, a tag !! might be good :o)

mani said...


Anglo, I wouldn't really be as comfortable as you are in dismissing the Charles de Menzes issue as a one off, due to poor intelligence which the poor man had to pay for... nor even the more naive idea (please forgive me anon) that the police were following him for weeks and weeks and then they shoot him because of his look.. these ideas are exactly teh ideas that the government expects the media to implant into the minds of the people.. one off's.. not-connected.. mistakes.. etc.. lets be real.. this intelligence rules the entire world you think this killing is a mistake???

No No my friends. This attack was planned, real and carried ut very efficiently by the police. The perpetrators are even rewarded to guard the queen and train new combatants ( It was designed to send a message of fear and psychological violence to the have-nots of the british population and a pretext for the robbing away of civil liberties like armed police on the streets, increase monitoring cctv, ID cards etc etc.. If you read the papers you will see that the Police LIED not made mistakes.. to cover up this horrific incident.. So lets be reasonable.. if the information is false.. then so are our conclusions.. about the causes of terror. .and who are the real perpetrators of terror.. cause once you find out that this killing is orchestrated.. like the attacks of 911, or pearl harbor or even 7/7.. then the next question will always beg itself to be asked especially people who have faith in the reason Allah swt gave them.. why? and who is behind it?

I quote from a blogger whos articles I include below, in addition to many others that will explain this issue to you further:

"Indeed, the bipartisan 9/11 Commission formed by the Bush administration to whitewash its response to—and possible complicity in—the September 11, 2001 attacks issued a report last week that declared the government’s failure to make substantive security improvements over the past four years “shocking.”

That is because the supposed concern over terrorism has from the beginning served merely as a multipurpose pretext. It has been used to justify the implementation of wide-ranging policies of war and repression that had been drawn up well before the planes ever struck New York’s Twin Towers and the Pentagon.

In the final analysis, these policies are aimed at benefiting a small financial oligarchy whose interests are so inimical to those of the vast majority of working people that it and its political representatives have abandoned even the pretense of a commitment to democratic rights. Rather, this ruling layer—both in Britain and the US—has increasingly seen constitutional rights and civil liberties as intolerable impediments to the pursuit of policies—the destruction of living standards and social services, tax cuts for the rich, predatory wars—that are opposed by the great majority of the people."

Please feel free to navigate the following articles:
entire archive of lies, cover ups, leaks and scandals:
De Menzes: The Facts:

Suliman said...

So 9/11 was a conspiracy that brought together Bin Laden and George Bush to work for the same objectives. And the support for Bin Laden among the Muslim masses is another western fabrication. And the hordes that came to his Jihad call from all over the world? Well, they probably thought they were just going to a wedding--their own with 72 round-eyed virgins. Fantastic! It all makes sense now. :-)

As long Muslims do not differentiate between faith as an entirely personal choice and ideology as a binding force of a supremacist cult, then they will need conspiracy theories to make it through the day. After 1400+ years of practical experimental evidence, people still blame misunderstanding, misreading, mis-whatever, and call for a return to square one in order to spread the "true Islam." It is difficult to face the reality of the Muslim world, even for one day, that's clear enough.

Any thoughts on the splitting of the moon in the 7th century? Is that another aspect of "the true miracle" still being covered up by the conspiring orientalist infidels? As long as such nonsense can be so widely accepted by mainstream Muslims, yes, they will need to resort to conspiracy and voodoo to make it through the day. And they will remain oppressed by their own because there is no shortage of people "who know better," people who know the "truth" and will do what's needed as soon as they get any power.

mani said...


Suliman, absolutely, a conspiracy that brought together Bin Laden and George Bush to work for the same objective.. in fact, they were bought together long before. Bin laden was a CIA agent and everyone knows the support that he and has factions received from US and Pakistani intelligence.. his family (being the conglomerates of Saudi construction business) also built the same mountain bunkers that powell and bush were showing us how they were going to ‘smoke’ out the mujahideen from..

In fact, this conspiracy is just that because the transnationalist imperialists and global elite know there’s nothing better than to put Bin laden on a podium for the ‘Muslims’ to worship and hence brand them all as terrorists. Another pretext for further ‘war on terror’. The same Muslims who have suffered for decades at hands of their local oppressors, directly funded, supported and guided by international interventionst forces, be they states, or financial elites. How do you think Bin laden seems to this people.. of course a hero.. so yes to this end it is a fabrication because its based on . I do not blame the repressed masses of the ‘Muslims’ of the Arab world for doing that because they are kept ignorant of Islamic and modern teachings alike by these so called ‘Islamists’, like you cant blame western societies who do not have access to real choices from following the fake messiahs and Heros of modernity that show them how to live; celebrities and politicians.

And there are no ‘hoards’… there were ‘hoards’ yes when the US and British government directly supported the mujahideen in Afghanistan… funding and financing the comms office run by Abdullah azzam to recruit mujahideen from allmuslims countries… back then.. they were touted as freedom fighters.. president Reagen even dedicated the Columbia shuttle launch back in 198 to them saying they represented mans fight for freedom everywhere in the world.. the hoards are becoming so right in their on countries, ,with the rise of islamic groups in party elections etc etc because its very clear now that the US and its allies are not really interested in promoting democracy .. or at least democracy as it mean to Muslims.. those that are waking up to their plight and asking questions when they were always suppressed by totalitarian Islamic teaching. Like that of Alazhar and the Saudi establishment.

Yes I agree.. Islam and the Quran is not a recipe for control or domination and it never was.. the concept of an Islamic state as espoused by the above mentioned establishments and old circles of the Muslim brotherhood is being discarded and eroded slowly by many waking minds.. its much more divine. .its personal enlightenment directed to every individual, teaching them of their wrong doings and regressions on God’s laws and guiding them to a straight path.. life is a constant struggle to do good in the face of mans limited reason and emotional weaknesses, bound by uncertainty of ‘3’aib’ and the limited lifespan we humans have.

W don’t need conspiracy theories mate. Conspiracies are not theories. Theories are ideas without a shred of evidence.. so that really means most official rhetoric, spin and media propaganda… conspiracies run your world whether you like it or not.. from the board rooms of transnational corporations that yield profits greater than many countries GDP combined…to the closed offices and meetings of a concentrated few in the elite, elected and selected, that do deals behind closed doors in the World Economic Forum, Bilderberg, Council on foreign relations, Bank of England, IMF, policy think tanks and research facilities, academic institutions, tada tada tada.. theories is just a word that spin doctors add to the term so people more interested in material self accumulation are not distracted and continue their selfless struggle trying to serve the system of usury capitalism that is taking the world by cultural onslaught, and force when necessary…

And I didn’t get these from the radical delusions of defeatist Muslims too.. this is serious western scholarship.. the real stuff which the media constantly violates by constricting its freedom of expression and the values of balanced reporting. What do you expect from a media establishment, entrenched in the ruling parties and ruled by a handful of oligarchal families in direct rejection of international conventions on human political and socio economic rights.

However, accepting this doesn’t mean that we as Muslims sit back relax and let others take the blame.. the very fact that we are the rat between cats in this game is a definite indicator that we are to blame. Tempted by the cheese thrown at our doorstep and teased by a false sense of security that we are God’s chosen ones and we will eventually ‘win’… what the hell?? and before we can call ourselves Muslims we have to appreciate the responsibility of doing so. What it means for your 3aqeeda what it means for your actions.. alhamdulillah there are many of us who are working in this regards.. yes we are rejected sometimes by the establishment of Muslims clerics like the Quranics and progressives etc but we are addressing important issues. I personally see that as long as Saudi and by extension Alazhar (both are still indirectly supported by US and UK governments) continue their ‘Islamic’ propagnda and brainwashing of citizens.. we are in for a huge showdown.. and the horrific reality seems to be drawing very near.. in fact.. the new theatre of war for the middle east has already been drawn up (complete with new borders and states) by the generals of US army (general Ralph peters) and you can see what their idea of a new ‘peaceful’ middle east, like condi said, may look like. Map and article (

It seems that you take your views much from the same establishments. For a critique on Orientalism’s role read the late Edward said and fellow contemporary postmodernists to get the jist. Read colonial and contemporary anthropology that analyses global political economy. For the farce of the War on terror, read Nafiz Ahmad’s Books “War on Truth” and “War on freedom”. He also has a book explaining the ‘conspiracy theory’ of the supposed 7/7 bombers and shows how they were actually harboured by MI5. He’s not a nut but an associate professor and academic at my university. for the invention of Al Qaeda, read Jason Burke’s ‘Alqaeda’.

And for the rest.. here.. listen and read to some Noam Chomsky.. he is ‘arguably the most important intellectual alive’ as said by NYT (

mani said...

a more insightful analysis of the hypocracy of Western states in their engagement with the Islamic World. the Author Ken Silverstein and you can find the origional here:

piccolina said...

well it's ok we all forget !!
i don't really remember why he came , all i know is that my dad was invited and my prof did invit only 3 students , me and my 2 friends , but when i came back home i found out that i'm invited with my dad coz my art pro was in charge to invit norman to libya, , so we went to corinthia and he gave a lecture about some of his projects , i don't think there was a plan for him to design something here ! to be honest , libyans don't really think of architecture as a big deal !!! soon inshallah they will !

AngloLibyan said...

inshaAllah piccolina with the help of people like you, Ema and others.

cofman said...

Anglo, I like to thank you for the space
btw & fyi, even when you don’t see my comment; eg working in libya, I visit your page regularly and spend more time here than in the café

Trabilsia said...

MashaAllah what a topic ! Anglo you're the best....
To answer your question which started the non ending debate of pointing fingers.........a matter which takes us nowhere hence no solution which could really be simplified, by stating:

" People don't trust what they don't understand ."

Let's leave governments aside,which do nothing for any race , religion,or cultural, but concentrate only on which percentage of the pie is up for the taking ! It's up to us the people of the world who should educate ourselves better of the world and learn to live in peace by setting an example to future generations to follow.
So the answer for me would be YES we can coexist if one is willing, with heart and soul for the benefit of all mankind.

cofman said...

ok, I live in the west and believe image - not substance or reality – sells,
and media is the required oxygen for image to survive and travel

give the public cow shit wrapped in Christmas paper, if legal you’ll make millions.
It is capitalism, consumerism, … that’s what they chose, and “ they” here means the over than 90% of the population who are non-moslems

Our image, again:
- I had time to see Anglo’s link on the Brazilian guy who was shot in London
I found “ The officers were watching three men who they claimed were Somali in appearance.”

- The most successful marketing genius in the world who helped Salman Rushdi promote his “ Satanic Verses ” was none other than his worst enemy; ayatollah al 7’omaini,

- The most hurtful insult I’ve ever felt was:- soon after 9-11 Waleed bin Talal went to the usa in his private jet, offering 10 million dollars to the victims
As soon as he showed them the dollars they showed him the toilet and recommended he could use his money to wipe

Is it a secret if I tell you my image stinks?

AngloLibyan said...

Thank you Trabilsia, you are so kind and your comment is true, wish many people would follow decent views by people such as yourself and Chatalaine.

cofman, what you said sounds awful but unfortunately is how it is for most of us.

BuJ said...

Did you notice the errors in BBC reporting a few days ago? They said the stadium was 4 yrs late!!!


It is 1 yr late, and it was supposed to take 3 yrs, so now it's taken 4 yrs to build.. ya3ni 33% longer than expected.. so it's not the end of the world,, especially for such a big project.

The result however is beautiful as demonstrated by your pictures.

AngloLibyan said...

Buj I read it was 4 years then 3 then 2 then 1 year late, the thing is I live near the stadium and really cant remember how long it took, so I will take your word for it :o)

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